Vital care funds cut for disabled Weymouth youngster

RARE DISORDER: Ali Webber and son Bradley

RARE DISORDER: Ali Webber and son Bradley

First published in News Dorset Echo: Photograph of the Author by , Reporter

A MUM whose five-year-old son fights for his life every day has hit out at the government for cutting off vital benefits.

Little Bradley Webber suffers with a form of brain damage called lissencephaly, also known as smooth brain, and was not expected to live past his third birthday.

The rare disorder means the Weymouth youngster cannot hold his head up, walk or talk and his mum Ali says every day of his life is a blessing.

Last week the family were told by the Department of Work and Pensions that their benefits, which included disability living allowance, mobility and carer’s allowance, had been stopped. The Government department said it had not received renewal forms in time.

However, mum Ali told the Echo that all forms had been completed correctly and handed in several weeks before the deadline. Without benefits the family are set to lose almost £600 a month.

It would also mean losing their mobility car, which the Chickerell family rely on to get to his hospital appointments in Southampton.

A spokesman for the Department of Work and Pensions it had followed ‘proper procedures’ and added: “If people don’t complete their forms on time we can’t process their claims”.

Bradley’s family have since been told a review of their case will take place in the next eight weeks.

Mum Ali, 25, added: “Bradley can’t walk or stand. He can’t drink or crawl or talk. He cannot communicate at all.

“His condition is terminal and life-limiting. He suffers with uncontrollable epilepsy where he can be in hospital fighting for his life and has scarring on his lungs and can’t control his secretions.

“Every day now could be his last. We tick the special box on the form so we just can’t believe we don’t meet the requirements for disability living allowance.”

She added: “I’m so angry and annoyed now as that £600 we lose means he can’t get the things he needs like all his equipment.

“I filled out his DLA form with all his doctor’s contact details and a statement from his community nurse.

“I received a letter last Saturday saying he is not entitled to DLA nor are we entitled to a carers’ allowance for him.

“He was awarded the middle rate care component from the DLA since he was two and high rate mobility from the age of three. We were eligible for all of these allowances before and now we apparently don’t meet the requirements.”

Bradley, who attends Wyvern school, has lessons each day in a bid to hold his head up for at least 30 seconds. The youngster is fed by a tube into his stomach and has seven types of daily medication including creams.

His condition was diagnosed when he was one.

Little Bradley is much-loved by his dad James and siblings Caitlyn, nine, six-year-old Tyler and the family’s newest addition – baby Felicity.

The family look set to lose around £542 disability and mobility allowance a month, around £62 a week carers’ allowance and income support and a reduction in child tax.

Echo launches appeal for Bradley

THE Dorset Echo has launched the Bradley Appeal in a bid to raise funds for the brave five-year-old and his family.

Money donated will go towards urgently needed equipment that the terminally ill youngster needs including a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family.

His mum Ali told the Echo that her family don’t go on holiday very often due to the financial strain.

She said: “We sacrifice our holidays so Bradley can have the equipment he needs – that’s our priority.”

You can donate by:

Cheque: You can send a cheque to the Dorset Echo, made payable to the Dorset Echo and posted to Fleet House, Hampshire Road, Weymouth, Dorset, DT4 9XD

Cash: You can drop cash in to the Echo offices in Weymouth or Antelope Walk, Dorchester.

Please make sure you include your name and contact number with the donation.

Comments (65)

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8:33am Wed 4 Jun 14

westbaywonder says...

Meanwhile Camoron pays £90 for his weekly hair trim.
As usual treat the citizens like rats,DWP should hang their heads in shame !
Meanwhile Camoron pays £90 for his weekly hair trim. As usual treat the citizens like rats,DWP should hang their heads in shame ! westbaywonder
  • Score: 18

8:48am Wed 4 Jun 14

mr commonsense says...

Why?
Why? mr commonsense
  • Score: 10

8:56am Wed 4 Jun 14

MaidofDorset says...

The family cope with a life that would flatten most of us. That they have to do battle over missing paperwork or appeal that this little boy really is disabled makes me ashamed of this country.

Is there really any point in constantly re-assessing someone for benefit if there is no hope of an improvement in health? Apart from increasing the profits of Atos at the tax payers expense.............
..
The family cope with a life that would flatten most of us. That they have to do battle over missing paperwork or appeal that this little boy really is disabled makes me ashamed of this country. Is there really any point in constantly re-assessing someone for benefit if there is no hope of an improvement in health? Apart from increasing the profits of Atos at the tax payers expense............. .. MaidofDorset
  • Score: 32

8:58am Wed 4 Jun 14

caz maz says...

DLA forms come out 5 months before you renewal is due and you are expected to return them within 4 to 6 weeks so the DWP have time to **** the claim properly, It comes with a letter stating " do not delay in returning the forms as we may not have time to **** your claim before your old claim runs out", they don't take in to consideration of course that if you are caring for a young man like this as well as the rest of the family 4 to 6 weeks really isn't enough time to fill out the forms due to the complexity of the forms and the child's needs. The family will receive the back pay when it is all sorted but that wont help in the short term when Mobility take away the child's much needed transport 2 weeks after the current claim ends. The whole presses of renewing a dla claim needs to be looked at................an
d not changed to a system even worse like PIP. The whole system is a mess!
DLA forms come out 5 months before you renewal is due and you are expected to return them within 4 to 6 weeks so the DWP have time to **** the claim properly, It comes with a letter stating " do not delay in returning the forms as we may not have time to **** your claim before your old claim runs out", they don't take in to consideration of course that if you are caring for a young man like this as well as the rest of the family 4 to 6 weeks really isn't enough time to fill out the forms due to the complexity of the forms and the child's needs. The family will receive the back pay when it is all sorted but that wont help in the short term when Mobility take away the child's much needed transport 2 weeks after the current claim ends. The whole presses of renewing a dla claim needs to be looked at................an d not changed to a system even worse like PIP. The whole system is a mess! caz maz
  • Score: 26

9:04am Wed 4 Jun 14

More Morals Please says...

Make me sad that the human race can do this to others.

The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work.
Make me sad that the human race can do this to others. The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work. More Morals Please
  • Score: 9

9:25am Wed 4 Jun 14

Douglas Mc says...

More Morals Please wrote:
Make me sad that the human race can do this to others.

The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work.
Not a Council issue. Some Civil Servant following the rules. I guess local politicians will be taking on as a matter of urgency.
[quote][p][bold]More Morals Please[/bold] wrote: Make me sad that the human race can do this to others. The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work.[/p][/quote]Not a Council issue. Some Civil Servant following the rules. I guess local politicians will be taking on as a matter of urgency. Douglas Mc
  • Score: 11

9:26am Wed 4 Jun 14

annotater says...

When the paperwork is sorted out, there will be an award made in respect of a back payment as well as continuation of the amounts stated. If the paperwork was sent in to the wrong department or it was mislaid at DWP, proof of postage is all that is required to speed the claim up. Rules are in place and sometimes take over, it will get sorted soon.
When the paperwork is sorted out, there will be an award made in respect of a back payment as well as continuation of the amounts stated. If the paperwork was sent in to the wrong department or it was mislaid at DWP, proof of postage is all that is required to speed the claim up. Rules are in place and sometimes take over, it will get sorted soon. annotater
  • Score: 14

10:14am Wed 4 Jun 14

1Kimberlin says...

Whilst I can understand the family's frustration & anger. Surely their sons award of benefits should when considering his severe condition be awarded in definately. My husband who is disabled has his carers & mobility allowance for an indefinite period. They will as said get back pay when this has been sorted out. In the short term ask the lads Dr to arrange Hospital Transport for the lad, it's free. Good Luck
Whilst I can understand the family's frustration & anger. Surely their sons award of benefits should when considering his severe condition be awarded in definately. My husband who is disabled has his carers & mobility allowance for an indefinite period. They will as said get back pay when this has been sorted out. In the short term ask the lads Dr to arrange Hospital Transport for the lad, it's free. Good Luck 1Kimberlin
  • Score: 18

10:24am Wed 4 Jun 14

ino69 says...

Erm... I know 1st hand how bad this system is. However, which is it. Were the forms late as the DWP say, or do they not qualify any more as mother says? Unfortunately if the forms were late they will take more time. But if you post them well before time, give DWP proof of posting, no more problem.
Erm... I know 1st hand how bad this system is. However, which is it. Were the forms late as the DWP say, or do they not qualify any more as mother says? Unfortunately if the forms were late they will take more time. But if you post them well before time, give DWP proof of posting, no more problem. ino69
  • Score: 15

10:31am Wed 4 Jun 14

leo210856 says...

As they say jobs worths

I can add little or nothing to the valid comments above and yes I fully applaud the idea of trying to raise some money what however I do get fed up about is that when the Echo, a commercial operation launches, these sort of appeals they never start the ball rolling with say a £500 or £1000 donation.
As they say jobs worths I can add little or nothing to the valid comments above and yes I fully applaud the idea of trying to raise some money what however I do get fed up about is that when the Echo, a commercial operation launches, these sort of appeals they never start the ball rolling with say a £500 or £1000 donation. leo210856
  • Score: -15

10:45am Wed 4 Jun 14

rosew60 says...

I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help... rosew60
  • Score: -1

11:43am Wed 4 Jun 14

sleepdeprivedmum says...

Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!! sleepdeprivedmum
  • Score: 20

12:29pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there.
They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge!
[quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!![/p][/quote]Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there. They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge! Loopy gal
  • Score: -12

12:37pm Wed 4 Jun 14

More Morals Please says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
Rose,

surely that naive out look it now out dated. There is ALWAYS someone on this planet worse off. This is more about helping those you can help and those you know how to help. Yes you work and I am dam sure that the mother in this story would prefer to work then have a disabled son. The £600 isnt a freebie or a reward for having a disabled son, its vital help so that her and her son can cope with a disability with the mother caring.

If you worked in the care industry at all you would see how much businesses charge clients or the government for home care so £600 is a huge saving.

The mother has enough to deal with knowing her son has a limited life span and as severe disability so the negative comments above are truly distasteful.

If anyone questioning why she needs it or finds time etc then they should look at the mother who is just trying to spend as much quality time with her son who has already out lived all expectations. I would not wish that on anyone let alone be as tragically bitter as some of the people on here.
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]Rose, surely that naive out look it now out dated. There is ALWAYS someone on this planet worse off. This is more about helping those you can help and those you know how to help. Yes you work and I am dam sure that the mother in this story would prefer to work then have a disabled son. The £600 isnt a freebie or a reward for having a disabled son, its vital help so that her and her son can cope with a disability with the mother caring. If you worked in the care industry at all you would see how much businesses charge clients or the government for home care so £600 is a huge saving. The mother has enough to deal with knowing her son has a limited life span and as severe disability so the negative comments above are truly distasteful. If anyone questioning why she needs it or finds time etc then they should look at the mother who is just trying to spend as much quality time with her son who has already out lived all expectations. I would not wish that on anyone let alone be as tragically bitter as some of the people on here. More Morals Please
  • Score: 18

12:49pm Wed 4 Jun 14

JamesYoung says...

With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.
With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt. JamesYoung
  • Score: 17

12:58pm Wed 4 Jun 14

iansedwell says...

This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.
This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys. iansedwell
  • Score: 18

1:02pm Wed 4 Jun 14

sleepdeprivedmum says...

Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there.
They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge!
Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.
[quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!![/p][/quote]Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there. They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge![/p][/quote]Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before. sleepdeprivedmum
  • Score: 6

1:06pm Wed 4 Jun 14

elloello1980 says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
slap yourself in the face!

What a selfish comment "I work don't get that". this is about a disabled child, not you!
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]slap yourself in the face! What a selfish comment "I work don't get that". this is about a disabled child, not you! elloello1980
  • Score: 22

1:06pm Wed 4 Jun 14

iansedwell says...

JamesYoung wrote:
With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.
Exactly James. But I gather from people who work in DWP that they are not permitted to exercise such discretion.
[quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.[/p][/quote]Exactly James. But I gather from people who work in DWP that they are not permitted to exercise such discretion. iansedwell
  • Score: 5

1:07pm Wed 4 Jun 14

elloello1980 says...

elloello1980 wrote:
rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
slap yourself in the face!

What a selfish comment "I work don't get that". this is about a disabled child, not you!
and perhaps if you could spell properly, and think more clearly, you'd be paid more.
[quote][p][bold]elloello1980[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]slap yourself in the face! What a selfish comment "I work don't get that". this is about a disabled child, not you![/p][/quote]and perhaps if you could spell properly, and think more clearly, you'd be paid more. elloello1980
  • Score: 10

1:28pm Wed 4 Jun 14

ViewPoyntz says...

This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article:
1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground
2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made?
This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article: 1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground 2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made? ViewPoyntz
  • Score: 10

1:57pm Wed 4 Jun 14

JoeyJo says...

While having every sympathy for this family I wonder if we are getting the whole and accurate story, something the Echo is not renowned for. There is a fast track system for terminally ill clients.
While having every sympathy for this family I wonder if we are getting the whole and accurate story, something the Echo is not renowned for. There is a fast track system for terminally ill clients. JoeyJo
  • Score: 8

2:21pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there.
They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge!
Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.
They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!!
But hey each 2 there own opinion!
[quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!![/p][/quote]Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there. They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge![/p][/quote]Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.[/p][/quote]They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!! But hey each 2 there own opinion! Loopy gal
  • Score: -7

2:23pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

ViewPoyntz wrote:
This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article:
1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground
2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made?
Yes the forms was sent off 1 week after reciving them.
[quote][p][bold]ViewPoyntz[/bold] wrote: This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article: 1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground 2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made?[/p][/quote]Yes the forms was sent off 1 week after reciving them. Loopy gal
  • Score: -3

2:32pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

And yes Bradley does qualify. As he is servely disabled. His parents are full time carers for him. And havnt had a full night sleep from the moment he was born. And they never will. As he don't understand night time means sleep. He has a mental age of a 5/6 month old baby. And he won't get better his condition will just worsen then 1day it be to bad and they lose there son!!!!
What parent should ever say good bye to there child? What parent should bury there own child! None. The child suppose be doing all that for there parents.
And to the small minded people out there. U carry on living your oh so perfect life's I just hope you don't go through what this family goes through every day. Not knowing when they wake up are they going walk into there child's bedroom to find there 5 year old son died? Every morning they go through that. Show this family some respect! They don't ask for much. But if other people in this community want help them who would refuse help? They need as much help and support as they can from this community!!! Why should they refuse it just for sake keep the small minded people happy because they jeliouse. Jeliousey is a ugly sight!
And yes Bradley does qualify. As he is servely disabled. His parents are full time carers for him. And havnt had a full night sleep from the moment he was born. And they never will. As he don't understand night time means sleep. He has a mental age of a 5/6 month old baby. And he won't get better his condition will just worsen then 1day it be to bad and they lose there son!!!! What parent should ever say good bye to there child? What parent should bury there own child! None. The child suppose be doing all that for there parents. And to the small minded people out there. U carry on living your oh so perfect life's I just hope you don't go through what this family goes through every day. Not knowing when they wake up are they going walk into there child's bedroom to find there 5 year old son died? Every morning they go through that. Show this family some respect! They don't ask for much. But if other people in this community want help them who would refuse help? They need as much help and support as they can from this community!!! Why should they refuse it just for sake keep the small minded people happy because they jeliouse. Jeliousey is a ugly sight! Loopy gal
  • Score: -14

2:43pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

How about we all stop thinking about the parents. And our selfs for 1 second!!!!
Ask your selfs this!
Did this family ask for there son be this way?
And is this family working as well?
And most of all think what impact all this has on Bradley!!!
Is the mother doing this for publicity or is she fighting for what's right for her son like any other mother would!! Why are people so quick 2 judge!!!! No they didn't ask for there son b how he is. The pray and wish for a Mirical that he can get better and be like his siblings.



For people who don't know this family!
The dad works as much as he can. What with Bradley's unexpected emergencey hospital admissions. So they do work so they don't get the top wack of benefits as they take the dad's earnings into account. So they pay there taxes and national insurance which pays out the benifits!
And most deffaintly not she not doing it for publicity. She hates picture taken she hates being in the paper. But she done it but her feelings and emotions 2 one side as the most important part of this is Bradley. And what he deserves and she will fight to the death for each and every1 of her children. As Bradley not got a voice she is being his voice. Just like any mother would.
How about we all stop thinking about the parents. And our selfs for 1 second!!!! Ask your selfs this! Did this family ask for there son be this way? And is this family working as well? And most of all think what impact all this has on Bradley!!! Is the mother doing this for publicity or is she fighting for what's right for her son like any other mother would!! Why are people so quick 2 judge!!!! No they didn't ask for there son b how he is. The pray and wish for a Mirical that he can get better and be like his siblings. For people who don't know this family! The dad works as much as he can. What with Bradley's unexpected emergencey hospital admissions. So they do work so they don't get the top wack of benefits as they take the dad's earnings into account. So they pay there taxes and national insurance which pays out the benifits! And most deffaintly not she not doing it for publicity. She hates picture taken she hates being in the paper. But she done it but her feelings and emotions 2 one side as the most important part of this is Bradley. And what he deserves and she will fight to the death for each and every1 of her children. As Bradley not got a voice she is being his voice. Just like any mother would. Loopy gal
  • Score: -11

2:52pm Wed 4 Jun 14

sleepdeprivedmum says...

Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there.
They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge!
Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.
They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!!
But hey each 2 there own opinion!
But if it was a charity funded holiday then why were u so worried about the deposit??? You surely must be used to getting inundated with phone calls due to your son having complex medical needs, holiday or no holiday??
[quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!![/p][/quote]Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there. They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge![/p][/quote]Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.[/p][/quote]They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!! But hey each 2 there own opinion![/p][/quote]But if it was a charity funded holiday then why were u so worried about the deposit??? You surely must be used to getting inundated with phone calls due to your son having complex medical needs, holiday or no holiday?? sleepdeprivedmum
  • Score: 13

2:53pm Wed 4 Jun 14

serenader says...

Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem!
Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem! serenader
  • Score: 17

3:03pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

serenader wrote:
Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem!
Exactly my point! It's the child!
It's not the family's fault!
[quote][p][bold]serenader[/bold] wrote: Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem![/p][/quote]Exactly my point! It's the child! It's not the family's fault! Loopy gal
  • Score: -5

3:06pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

serenader wrote:
Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem!
Maybe the family didn't want lose the deposit because was from a charity. And that the charity would of lost the money that could of been used on another family. But the only person who knows that is the family. So u need keep you small minded selfish thoughts and opinions to yourself until u know full story and all the facts. Instead making osumpsions!
[quote][p][bold]serenader[/bold] wrote: Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem![/p][/quote]Maybe the family didn't want lose the deposit because was from a charity. And that the charity would of lost the money that could of been used on another family. But the only person who knows that is the family. So u need keep you small minded selfish thoughts and opinions to yourself until u know full story and all the facts. Instead making osumpsions! Loopy gal
  • Score: -17

3:06pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

serenader wrote:
Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem!
Maybe the family didn't want lose the deposit because was from a charity. And that the charity would of lost the money that could of been used on another family. But the only person who knows that is the family. So u need keep you small minded selfish thoughts and opinions to yourself until u know full story and all the facts. Instead making osumpsions!
[quote][p][bold]serenader[/bold] wrote: Its worth reminding some of you that whatever your opinion of the family the forms the holiday or amount of benefits there is a child here going without and suffering I don't blame the parents personally but for some reason some of you seem to be having a pop! At the end of the day a sick child is going without at someones elses mistake! Hes the one suffering and the one who can not solve this problem![/p][/quote]Maybe the family didn't want lose the deposit because was from a charity. And that the charity would of lost the money that could of been used on another family. But the only person who knows that is the family. So u need keep you small minded selfish thoughts and opinions to yourself until u know full story and all the facts. Instead making osumpsions! Loopy gal
  • Score: -14

3:21pm Wed 4 Jun 14

sleepdeprivedmum says...

Fair enough.... My mistake, I'd happily donate money money to Bradley for his much needed equipment rather than sending his family on another holiday which they clearly wouldn't enjoy anyway !!!!!
Fair enough.... My mistake, I'd happily donate money money to Bradley for his much needed equipment rather than sending his family on another holiday which they clearly wouldn't enjoy anyway !!!!! sleepdeprivedmum
  • Score: 16

3:34pm Wed 4 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
I can't say anything in response to this. Me of all people lost for words. This is perhaps the one time in my life that I really, really do wish that I had Winston Spencer Churchill's knowledge of the English language so that I could properly express my feelings of disgust, only far more vehemently.
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]I can't say anything in response to this. Me of all people lost for words. This is perhaps the one time in my life that I really, really do wish that I had Winston Spencer Churchill's knowledge of the English language so that I could properly express my feelings of disgust, only far more vehemently. breamoreboy
  • Score: 12

3:38pm Wed 4 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

iansedwell wrote:
This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.
I am disgusted by your comment. Please withdraw it. They're not that pleasant.
[quote][p][bold]iansedwell[/bold] wrote: This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.[/p][/quote]I am disgusted by your comment. Please withdraw it. They're not that pleasant. breamoreboy
  • Score: 0

3:39pm Wed 4 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
And I've just realised that this has been scored up. WTF???
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]And I've just realised that this has been scored up. WTF??? breamoreboy
  • Score: -1

3:43pm Wed 4 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

ViewPoyntz wrote:
This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article:
1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground
2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made?
Attack is the best form of defence.
[quote][p][bold]ViewPoyntz[/bold] wrote: This is a sad case but there are a couple of questions that aren't answered by this article: 1) Were the forms submitted late? Suspect the DWP wouldn't wheel out a spokesperson unless they were pretty sure of their ground 2) Does Bradley qualify for DLA? What criteria does he meet or fail to meet? What has changed from when the payments were made?[/p][/quote]Attack is the best form of defence. breamoreboy
  • Score: -7

3:52pm Wed 4 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem.
My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem. breamoreboy
  • Score: 3

4:09pm Wed 4 Jun 14

anika says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
They are LUCKY - are you completely mad?
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]They are LUCKY - are you completely mad? anika
  • Score: 6

4:16pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Loopy gal says...

sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Fair enough.... My mistake, I'd happily donate money money to Bradley for his much needed equipment rather than sending his family on another holiday which they clearly wouldn't enjoy anyway !!!!!
That's what they say. They would rather the money go towards something that Bradley would benefit from. As always at the back there minds when on a holiday they think the money could gone on equipment that Bradley will benefit from.
But on the other hand they say they gotta think on the elder 2 as well. And reward them for there understanding help. Etc and everything they go through as well. So the parents are in sticky situation and just tries there best for there children and do there best to reward the elder 2 best way they please. They ask they children what they want and they chose.
The parents may not enjoyd there last holiday as much as they wanted 2 coz they couldn't spoil all the kids. But they tried making the best of a bad situation and make sure the kids enjoyed them selfs best as they could.
The kids don't get many treats so they get a treat once a year of there choice. It also gives them something to look forward 2.
[quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Fair enough.... My mistake, I'd happily donate money money to Bradley for his much needed equipment rather than sending his family on another holiday which they clearly wouldn't enjoy anyway !!!!![/p][/quote]That's what they say. They would rather the money go towards something that Bradley would benefit from. As always at the back there minds when on a holiday they think the money could gone on equipment that Bradley will benefit from. But on the other hand they say they gotta think on the elder 2 as well. And reward them for there understanding help. Etc and everything they go through as well. So the parents are in sticky situation and just tries there best for there children and do there best to reward the elder 2 best way they please. They ask they children what they want and they chose. The parents may not enjoyd there last holiday as much as they wanted 2 coz they couldn't spoil all the kids. But they tried making the best of a bad situation and make sure the kids enjoyed them selfs best as they could. The kids don't get many treats so they get a treat once a year of there choice. It also gives them something to look forward 2. Loopy gal
  • Score: -6

5:34pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Genghis says...

JamesYoung wrote:
With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.
I can agree with you on most of what you say James apart from the small minded moron jibe at staff in the DWP. They have procedures set down to follow. Procedures that are made by their betters in higher places, such as Parliament. They are working in an atmosphere where the government, it's supporters and voters want to see cuts initiated and money saved on benefits. Don't shoot the unlucky servant that has to carry out the end result of those policies.

In hindsight, it's easy to see that this is a genuine case. What would have happened though if a "small minded moron" ignored the procedures? What if they decided, on their own initiative, to pay out hundreds of pounds per month to somebody that later turned out, didn't qualify for them? What would be the comments then?

Yes, the benefits system needs fixing. But it needs fixing to cut out the abuses and not to punish those in genuine need. What we got now is the mess created by those in power who put political dogma before serving the people.
[quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.[/p][/quote]I can agree with you on most of what you say James apart from the small minded moron jibe at staff in the DWP. They have procedures set down to follow. Procedures that are made by their betters in higher places, such as Parliament. They are working in an atmosphere where the government, it's supporters and voters want to see cuts initiated and money saved on benefits. Don't shoot the unlucky servant that has to carry out the end result of those policies. In hindsight, it's easy to see that this is a genuine case. What would have happened though if a "small minded moron" ignored the procedures? What if they decided, on their own initiative, to pay out hundreds of pounds per month to somebody that later turned out, didn't qualify for them? What would be the comments then? Yes, the benefits system needs fixing. But it needs fixing to cut out the abuses and not to punish those in genuine need. What we got now is the mess created by those in power who put political dogma before serving the people. Genghis
  • Score: 16

5:43pm Wed 4 Jun 14

bigfatlad says...

This is not the first time I have been left speechless by the DWP's behaviour. I am unable to comment without using foul and abusive language....
This is not the first time I have been left speechless by the DWP's behaviour. I am unable to comment without using foul and abusive language.... bigfatlad
  • Score: 7

6:03pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Lajabe says...

I am absolutely disgusted at some peoples views! I myself am a mother of a disabled child. He receives DLA at the same rate as this child and I receive Carers allowance also. This is an absolute necessity - we are not 'LUCKY'! I work part time & my husband full. As well as having a disabled child and 2 other children. We have paid in all our lives to the system that the government we voted in runs. Why shouldn't we be entitled to the money we paid into in the first place?
Our family holidays are not relaxing.. The other siblings and the disabled child do deserve the opportunity to go on holiday but this is usually at the cost of the sanity of the parents.. They deserve a holiday on their own!!
As for the payments.. I would be straight on the phone to your MP.. Will be very quickly sorted!
Just remember - mothers of disabled children are usually like lions and will always defend their cubs!! Hugs to the whole family xxx
I am absolutely disgusted at some peoples views! I myself am a mother of a disabled child. He receives DLA at the same rate as this child and I receive Carers allowance also. This is an absolute necessity - we are not 'LUCKY'! I work part time & my husband full. As well as having a disabled child and 2 other children. We have paid in all our lives to the system that the government we voted in runs. Why shouldn't we be entitled to the money we paid into in the first place? Our family holidays are not relaxing.. The other siblings and the disabled child do deserve the opportunity to go on holiday but this is usually at the cost of the sanity of the parents.. They deserve a holiday on their own!! As for the payments.. I would be straight on the phone to your MP.. Will be very quickly sorted! Just remember - mothers of disabled children are usually like lions and will always defend their cubs!! Hugs to the whole family xxx Lajabe
  • Score: 11

7:56pm Wed 4 Jun 14

oldbrock says...

rosew60 wrote:
I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...
and so should people in this country get this help, why are you whining about people in other countries , that is their governments responsibility not stupid soft touch Britain sending out aid to countries with Space Programs while we have FOOD BANKS and people being treated like this by DWP, get real, we live in Britain and our money should be spent in Britain, not politicians and do-gooders scoring brownie points by sending money that is clearly needed HERE!! send your OWN savings if you want, I don't want a single penny of mine sending abroad when we have poverty here
[quote][p][bold]rosew60[/bold] wrote: I can understand the families frustration but they should of filled the form out as soon as got it WHY do you need 5 or 6 weeks to do so?? they are lucky to get £600 a month benefits I work don't get that!!! yes they have a very ill son but soon not rely on all the benefits! Cannot believe know the echo asking for donation, there are people in other countries a lot worse off do not get benefits at all, got to pay for hospital treatment or do not get seen, people in England on benefits get to much help...[/p][/quote]and so should people in this country get this help, why are you whining about people in other countries , that is their governments responsibility not stupid soft touch Britain sending out aid to countries with Space Programs while we have FOOD BANKS and people being treated like this by DWP, get real, we live in Britain and our money should be spent in Britain, not politicians and do-gooders scoring brownie points by sending money that is clearly needed HERE!! send your OWN savings if you want, I don't want a single penny of mine sending abroad when we have poverty here oldbrock
  • Score: 2

9:07pm Wed 4 Jun 14

ino69 says...

breamoreboy wrote:
My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem.
What if your MP is a millionaire public schoolboy?
[quote][p][bold]breamoreboy[/bold] wrote: My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem.[/p][/quote]What if your MP is a millionaire public schoolboy? ino69
  • Score: 3

10:03pm Wed 4 Jun 14

JamesYoung says...

Genghis wrote:
JamesYoung wrote:
With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.
I can agree with you on most of what you say James apart from the small minded moron jibe at staff in the DWP. They have procedures set down to follow. Procedures that are made by their betters in higher places, such as Parliament. They are working in an atmosphere where the government, it's supporters and voters want to see cuts initiated and money saved on benefits. Don't shoot the unlucky servant that has to carry out the end result of those policies.

In hindsight, it's easy to see that this is a genuine case. What would have happened though if a "small minded moron" ignored the procedures? What if they decided, on their own initiative, to pay out hundreds of pounds per month to somebody that later turned out, didn't qualify for them? What would be the comments then?

Yes, the benefits system needs fixing. But it needs fixing to cut out the abuses and not to punish those in genuine need. What we got now is the mess created by those in power who put political dogma before serving the people.
That's fair comment, i apologise.
[quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: With every day that passes i feel more embarrassed that i voted for this thieving government. At the very least, there should be a process in place for cases like this where the claim is extended while the paperwork is sorted out. As someone else commented, it should be blindingly obvious to the most small minded moron in the DWP that the claim will be a continual one. £600 a month is a lot of money to lose and by the time the backpay arrives i would imagine the family will be in a lot of debt.[/p][/quote]I can agree with you on most of what you say James apart from the small minded moron jibe at staff in the DWP. They have procedures set down to follow. Procedures that are made by their betters in higher places, such as Parliament. They are working in an atmosphere where the government, it's supporters and voters want to see cuts initiated and money saved on benefits. Don't shoot the unlucky servant that has to carry out the end result of those policies. In hindsight, it's easy to see that this is a genuine case. What would have happened though if a "small minded moron" ignored the procedures? What if they decided, on their own initiative, to pay out hundreds of pounds per month to somebody that later turned out, didn't qualify for them? What would be the comments then? Yes, the benefits system needs fixing. But it needs fixing to cut out the abuses and not to punish those in genuine need. What we got now is the mess created by those in power who put political dogma before serving the people.[/p][/quote]That's fair comment, i apologise. JamesYoung
  • Score: 4

10:07pm Wed 4 Jun 14

JamesYoung says...

sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Loopy gal wrote:
sleepdeprivedmum wrote:
Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!!
Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there.
They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge!
Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.
They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!!
But hey each 2 there own opinion!
But if it was a charity funded holiday then why were u so worried about the deposit??? You surely must be used to getting inundated with phone calls due to your son having complex medical needs, holiday or no holiday??
I suspect if any of us had to deal with this family's problems, we'd be desperate for a holiday. I just cannot begin to imagine what it is like to have to look after a child or adult with complex health needs 24 hours a day. To suggest that they are in some way lucky to get these benefits is quite frankly ridiculous. As for a holiday, i suspect that if any of us was to endure this 24*7, 365 days a year, that holiday would be a lifeline, not a luxury.
[quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Loopy gal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sleepdeprivedmum[/bold] wrote: Holiday for this family!!!!! They've only just been on one last month!!!!![/p][/quote]Yes they had a holiday last month. But was only 2 Bognor Regis butlins. Not much holiday. Coz rained every day. Had budget of spending money. Had wait end of holiday 2 but kids treats which they never got as the shops shut and fare closed. As it was the last day and getting ready 4 the next holiday makers. Kids went bed there normal bed time same as parents. There eve consisted of home cooked food as if they was home. And sat in front of telly. Nothing special there. They use the DLA to buy all Bradley's equipment he NEEDS 2 help him. And they had fork out week before they went away for more equipment! As the suitable equipment is not cheap usualy 4 figures. And they don't get help with that. So people need get there facts correct before they judge. Plus they never asked for donations. They don't expect any. The people of the echo thought it would b nice and try and help this family as best as they can! So don't be so quick 2 judge![/p][/quote]Not disputing that you don't need equipment for your son as have been told how expensive it can be from friends, But it was still a holiday though wasn't it?? It's still time away from home... I have friends with disabled children who haven't even done that before.[/p][/quote]They done exactly what they would do at home only difference was under a diff roof. And 5 days of no medical appointments. Still had the phone going off left right Center regarding Bradley. If the deposit hadn't of been paid and would lost it, they wouldn't of gone! Only went due to the deposit. Any how how do you know they paid for the holiday them selfs. How do u know a charity didn't pay 4 it 4 Bradley??? You don't. Only the family does. But yeah you carry on judging this family. I just hope you don't have to go through or have a child as bad as this!!!! But hey each 2 there own opinion![/p][/quote]But if it was a charity funded holiday then why were u so worried about the deposit??? You surely must be used to getting inundated with phone calls due to your son having complex medical needs, holiday or no holiday??[/p][/quote]I suspect if any of us had to deal with this family's problems, we'd be desperate for a holiday. I just cannot begin to imagine what it is like to have to look after a child or adult with complex health needs 24 hours a day. To suggest that they are in some way lucky to get these benefits is quite frankly ridiculous. As for a holiday, i suspect that if any of us was to endure this 24*7, 365 days a year, that holiday would be a lifeline, not a luxury. JamesYoung
  • Score: 7

1:04am Thu 5 Jun 14

Micke12 says...

It is more likely that these forms were mislaid at these central sorting offices at Wolverhampton. I sent paperwork to DWP which had to go to Chippenham Benefits Delivery Centre (BDC) to process my claim for ESA and fit notes from my doctors. These all had to be sent via the Wolverhampton Mail Processing Centre in order to be despatched back to the Chippenham BDC.

One form to 5 weeks to get to the BDC which resulted in my benefits being stopped for four weeks and when the fit note went missing it took six weeks for Wolverhampton to chase the form up and send it to Chippenham BDC.

So, it seems to me that it might be nothing to do with whether Ali sent the paperwork in in time, but more to do with the stupid process of sending all this paperwork by post to a central mail sorting centre, which, by it's very definition, is likely to result in paperwork not getting delivered either by loss of the paperwork or any other reason.

In days of old, you could go down to the local JobCentre Plus offices and hand the forms in there, get a receipt and they would send it through their internal postal system direct to the relevant BDC. You can still do that, but you have to phone the general enquiry line and ask them to book you an appointment to hand the paperwork in.

It is unsurprising I suppose, that whilst the local JobCentre Plus office reduced it's workload by not openly handling this type of work, they have kept on the same number of staff, so the same staff do less actual work but still get the same pay because they are salaried.

It is wrong that people should get paid the same money for doing less work than they were originally employed to do. Face to face meetings with the local JCP staff were a much better way of dealing with claimants directly and things got done, usually there and then, whereas now, as we can see, the whole system is starting to collapse, and this is all due to centralisation by Labour and Tory governments in the past 20 years, mainly brought about by technology changes that are not, in fact, fit for purpose.

One of the other main problems is the faceless 'Decision Maker', who is the Secretary of States mouthpiece when it comes to benefit decisions. These faceless people make decisions on peoples benefits, be it decisions to award benefits, deny benefits or impose sanctions.

These faceless people are supplied with medical evidence by a claimants doctor, a person who has been in contact regularly with their patient and knows the background to the patients illnesses, but then some tosser from ATOS comes along, spends 30 minutes or less with the claimant and then reports back to the Decision Maker that the claimant is fit to work, after this healthcare 'professional' has had just 6 weeks training for the job, not sufficient time to learn the in's and out's of every single disability, but these people are given the title of 'Disability Analysts'

Since when have nurses been practicing doctors. that's right, some of the people giving these powers are just nurses, SRN's or SEN's. We all know that the contract the government has with ATOS, is one of fail everyone on the WCA unless they are dead or dying, which is why there is a 90% plus ration of failures on fitness assessments by ATOS HCPs, and the laughing point is, is that the Decision Maker will then totally ignore what your own doctor or consultant has written in his report to the Decision Maker and always accept that the ATOS HCP is telling the bloody truth.

I hear you ask the question, 'Why do Decision Makers only go by the HCPs diagnosis and not the GP's or consultant'. Well the answer is quite simple, the government believes that local GP's and Consultants, are more likely to lie on their patients behalf and therefore, their judgements and observations are not 100% trustworthy. So, a doctor or consultant in the NHS spends 6 or more years training for his or her profession, as opposed to 6 weeks for some ATOS HCP, who has no real disabilty clinical background, and is called a liar by the government and HCP's. Do you really think a professional GP or consultant would risk his or her position in society by lying on behalf of their patient to a government department. Is it any wonder that staff in the NHS clinical positions are so low on morale at the moment.

One more comment in relation to the benefits and the cost thereof to the British taxpayer. If we split the DWP benefits budget down into who gets what, we see that in 2011-2012 welfare spending, 51% is spent of pensions and pension credits, 4% on Incapacity Benefit, 3% on Attendance Allowance, 3% on Council Tax Benefit, 3% on Jobseeker's Allowance, 2% on Winter Fuel Payments, 2% on Employment and Support Allowance, 1% on Statutory Maternity Pay, 1% on Carer's Allowance, 3% on other, unspecified payments, 5% on Income Support, 8% on Disability Living Allowance, now known as PIP, and 14% on Housing Benefit. When you add these all together, you see that if the pensions services were removed from the balance sheet of the DWP, the total benefits bill would be reduced by 51%, more than half. But what do we here from this government - OK, let's give the pensioners more money. I have no problem with that in any way as pensioners have worked and earned their pensions, but all we here is the government and the press blaming the other benefit claimants for the amount of the benefits bill to the taxpayer, but things have a different complexion when you take out the biggest drain on those taxpayers pounds to the treasury, the pensions.

In 20112-2012, the total budget for welfare spending was a staggering £200,000,000,000 - 200 biilion pounds sterling. Of this, £102,000,000,000 - £102 billion was for pensions and pension credits, whereas, £98,000,000,000 - £98 billion pounds sterling went on all other benefits claimed under the Social Security regulations. That is quite some difference is it not. Those figures are provided by the Institute for Fiscal Studies and are very accurate to within 100,000,000 either way.

So before people start slagging off the disabled and job seekers, look at the facts. Yes, the budget for these other benefits are still quite high, but it is not as bad as the government and tory press would have you believe.

I am looking forward to having some abuse thrown at me on this one, but then I would be disappointed if that were not the case - I always enjoy a good debate with people who are sensible and put forward good arguments.
It is more likely that these forms were mislaid at these central sorting offices at Wolverhampton. I sent paperwork to DWP which had to go to Chippenham Benefits Delivery Centre (BDC) to process my claim for ESA and fit notes from my doctors. These all had to be sent via the Wolverhampton Mail Processing Centre in order to be despatched back to the Chippenham BDC. One form to 5 weeks to get to the BDC which resulted in my benefits being stopped for four weeks and when the fit note went missing it took six weeks for Wolverhampton to chase the form up and send it to Chippenham BDC. So, it seems to me that it might be nothing to do with whether Ali sent the paperwork in in time, but more to do with the stupid process of sending all this paperwork by post to a central mail sorting centre, which, by it's very definition, is likely to result in paperwork not getting delivered either by loss of the paperwork or any other reason. In days of old, you could go down to the local JobCentre Plus offices and hand the forms in there, get a receipt and they would send it through their internal postal system direct to the relevant BDC. You can still do that, but you have to phone the general enquiry line and ask them to book you an appointment to hand the paperwork in. It is unsurprising I suppose, that whilst the local JobCentre Plus office reduced it's workload by not openly handling this type of work, they have kept on the same number of staff, so the same staff do less actual work but still get the same pay because they are salaried. It is wrong that people should get paid the same money for doing less work than they were originally employed to do. Face to face meetings with the local JCP staff were a much better way of dealing with claimants directly and things got done, usually there and then, whereas now, as we can see, the whole system is starting to collapse, and this is all due to centralisation by Labour and Tory governments in the past 20 years, mainly brought about by technology changes that are not, in fact, fit for purpose. One of the other main problems is the faceless 'Decision Maker', who is the Secretary of States mouthpiece when it comes to benefit decisions. These faceless people make decisions on peoples benefits, be it decisions to award benefits, deny benefits or impose sanctions. These faceless people are supplied with medical evidence by a claimants doctor, a person who has been in contact regularly with their patient and knows the background to the patients illnesses, but then some tosser from ATOS comes along, spends 30 minutes or less with the claimant and then reports back to the Decision Maker that the claimant is fit to work, after this healthcare 'professional' has had just 6 weeks training for the job, not sufficient time to learn the in's and out's of every single disability, but these people are given the title of 'Disability Analysts' Since when have nurses been practicing doctors. that's right, some of the people giving these powers are just nurses, SRN's or SEN's. We all know that the contract the government has with ATOS, is one of fail everyone on the WCA unless they are dead or dying, which is why there is a 90% plus ration of failures on fitness assessments by ATOS HCPs, and the laughing point is, is that the Decision Maker will then totally ignore what your own doctor or consultant has written in his report to the Decision Maker and always accept that the ATOS HCP is telling the bloody truth. I hear you ask the question, 'Why do Decision Makers only go by the HCPs diagnosis and not the GP's or consultant'. Well the answer is quite simple, the government believes that local GP's and Consultants, are more likely to lie on their patients behalf and therefore, their judgements and observations are not 100% trustworthy. So, a doctor or consultant in the NHS spends 6 or more years training for his or her profession, as opposed to 6 weeks for some ATOS HCP, who has no real disabilty clinical background, and is called a liar by the government and HCP's. Do you really think a professional GP or consultant would risk his or her position in society by lying on behalf of their patient to a government department. Is it any wonder that staff in the NHS clinical positions are so low on morale at the moment. One more comment in relation to the benefits and the cost thereof to the British taxpayer. If we split the DWP benefits budget down into who gets what, we see that in 2011-2012 welfare spending, 51% is spent of pensions and pension credits, 4% on Incapacity Benefit, 3% on Attendance Allowance, 3% on Council Tax Benefit, 3% on Jobseeker's Allowance, 2% on Winter Fuel Payments, 2% on Employment and Support Allowance, 1% on Statutory Maternity Pay, 1% on Carer's Allowance, 3% on other, unspecified payments, 5% on Income Support, 8% on Disability Living Allowance, now known as PIP, and 14% on Housing Benefit. When you add these all together, you see that if the pensions services were removed from the balance sheet of the DWP, the total benefits bill would be reduced by 51%, more than half. But what do we here from this government - OK, let's give the pensioners more money. I have no problem with that in any way as pensioners have worked and earned their pensions, but all we here is the government and the press blaming the other benefit claimants for the amount of the benefits bill to the taxpayer, but things have a different complexion when you take out the biggest drain on those taxpayers pounds to the treasury, the pensions. In 20112-2012, the total budget for welfare spending was a staggering £200,000,000,000 - 200 biilion pounds sterling. Of this, £102,000,000,000 - £102 billion was for pensions and pension credits, whereas, £98,000,000,000 - £98 billion pounds sterling went on all other benefits claimed under the Social Security regulations. That is quite some difference is it not. Those figures are provided by the Institute for Fiscal Studies and are very accurate to within 100,000,000 either way. So before people start slagging off the disabled and job seekers, look at the facts. Yes, the budget for these other benefits are still quite high, but it is not as bad as the government and tory press would have you believe. I am looking forward to having some abuse thrown at me on this one, but then I would be disappointed if that were not the case - I always enjoy a good debate with people who are sensible and put forward good arguments. Micke12
  • Score: 5

6:11am Thu 5 Jun 14

Genghis says...

Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures. Genghis
  • Score: 4

8:03am Thu 5 Jun 14

Rocksalt says...

In response to Micke. No, I wouldn't accuse GPs and consultants if lying. But I do think that some take the path of least resistance.

( In the same way that some GPs still give people antibiotics to keep people quiet, even when they know they won't work).

In my experience, some GPs etc also have a pretty limited understanding of what a person can or can't do at work and/or the measures employers can take to help people work.
In response to Micke. No, I wouldn't accuse GPs and consultants if lying. But I do think that some take the path of least resistance. ( In the same way that some GPs still give people antibiotics to keep people quiet, even when they know they won't work). In my experience, some GPs etc also have a pretty limited understanding of what a person can or can't do at work and/or the measures employers can take to help people work. Rocksalt
  • Score: 0

9:53am Thu 5 Jun 14

Big Jimbo says...

Douglas Mc wrote:
More Morals Please wrote:
Make me sad that the human race can do this to others.

The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work.
Not a Council issue. Some Civil Servant following the rules. I guess local politicians will be taking on as a matter of urgency.
Use of Computors for essential purposes should be more rigourosly supervised. There Is to much "Social Network" going on.
[quote][p][bold]Douglas Mc[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]More Morals Please[/bold] wrote: Make me sad that the human race can do this to others. The council are quick enough to hand out benefits and houses, cars money to many less deserving. Its shame people with such a difficult life that need help are left stranded because of paper work.[/p][/quote]Not a Council issue. Some Civil Servant following the rules. I guess local politicians will be taking on as a matter of urgency.[/p][/quote]Use of Computors for essential purposes should be more rigourosly supervised. There Is to much "Social Network" going on. Big Jimbo
  • Score: -3

10:46am Thu 5 Jun 14

Micke12 says...

Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
[quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population. Micke12
  • Score: 0

1:21pm Fri 6 Jun 14

JamesYoung says...

Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties.
With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites).
I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.
[quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.[/p][/quote]The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties. With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites). I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government. JamesYoung
  • Score: 1

4:39pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Genghis says...

JamesYoung wrote:
Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties.
With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites).
I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.
Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.
[quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.[/p][/quote]The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties. With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites). I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.[/p][/quote]Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf. Genghis
  • Score: 0

9:54pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Micke12 says...

Genghis wrote:
JamesYoung wrote:
Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties.
With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites).
I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.
Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.
I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there.

Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories.

But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems.

I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate.

Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities.

I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE'
[quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.[/p][/quote]The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties. With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites). I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.[/p][/quote]Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.[/p][/quote]I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there. Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories. But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems. I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate. Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities. I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE' Micke12
  • Score: 0

10:33pm Fri 6 Jun 14

Taxpayer!! says...

Well what a farce!! Yes the poor boy is disabled and yes the poor boy has needs, but when the mothers response on a social networking site is"yeah Brads DLA is sorted" I get my DLA (yes mother claims it too)!! So can get my hair cut and roots done before our girly trip to Southampton! Just off for toning session on the vibration plates!!

What a joke ! So is this money for the child or parents lifestyle?
I work hard to pay my bills and provide for my children as for a holiday........yes please can't remember the last one
Just checkout the social networking sites, yes you know the one! I would love to have holiday pictures in my photo albums!

Rant over but please think before giving up your hard earnt money, benefits are awarded to make sure this child has what he needs, so surely if he is going without equipment his money is being spent elsewhere??
Well what a farce!! Yes the poor boy is disabled and yes the poor boy has needs, but when the mothers response on a social networking site is"yeah Brads DLA is sorted" I get my DLA (yes mother claims it too)!! So can get my hair cut and roots done before our girly trip to Southampton! Just off for toning session on the vibration plates!! What a joke ! So is this money for the child or parents lifestyle? I work hard to pay my bills and provide for my children as for a holiday........yes please can't remember the last one Just checkout the social networking sites, yes you know the one! I would love to have holiday pictures in my photo albums! Rant over but please think before giving up your hard earnt money, benefits are awarded to make sure this child has what he needs, so surely if he is going without equipment his money is being spent elsewhere?? Taxpayer!!
  • Score: 10

12:35am Sat 7 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

ino69 wrote:
breamoreboy wrote:
My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem.
What if your MP is a millionaire public schoolboy?
It doesn't make any difference at all. They just listen to your problem and take it up with the appropriate minister. Strangely enough once said minister gets involved it's amazing how quickly things happen
[quote][p][bold]ino69[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]breamoreboy[/bold] wrote: My advice to the family is if you can't get some form of interim payment from the DWP by close of business Friday contact your MP. Past experience tells me that they're actually very good at sorting out this type of problem.[/p][/quote]What if your MP is a millionaire public schoolboy?[/p][/quote]It doesn't make any difference at all. They just listen to your problem and take it up with the appropriate minister. Strangely enough once said minister gets involved it's amazing how quickly things happen breamoreboy
  • Score: -4

12:43am Sat 7 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

Rocksalt wrote:
In response to Micke. No, I wouldn't accuse GPs and consultants if lying. But I do think that some take the path of least resistance.

( In the same way that some GPs still give people antibiotics to keep people quiet, even when they know they won't work).

In my experience, some GPs etc also have a pretty limited understanding of what a person can or can't do at work and/or the measures employers can take to help people work.
True, but the unqualified people that ATOS were using knew even less. How a fitness for work test can consist of bending over and picking up a piece of paper I don't know, but that's been used with folks that I know personally.
[quote][p][bold]Rocksalt[/bold] wrote: In response to Micke. No, I wouldn't accuse GPs and consultants if lying. But I do think that some take the path of least resistance. ( In the same way that some GPs still give people antibiotics to keep people quiet, even when they know they won't work). In my experience, some GPs etc also have a pretty limited understanding of what a person can or can't do at work and/or the measures employers can take to help people work.[/p][/quote]True, but the unqualified people that ATOS were using knew even less. How a fitness for work test can consist of bending over and picking up a piece of paper I don't know, but that's been used with folks that I know personally. breamoreboy
  • Score: -2

2:31am Sat 7 Jun 14

JamesYoung says...

Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
JamesYoung wrote:
Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties.
With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites).
I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.
Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.
I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there.

Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories.

But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems.

I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate.

Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities.

I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE'
Sadly, you are peddling the establishment's lie. I've voted in every general election since i was 18. I've also been a Tory branch chair. I've seen it from the inside and the outside and believe me, there's nothing the establishment likes more than seeing the sheep thinking they are exercising some kind of democratic right. A democratic right to what? Vote for only one of three parties, because most of us have a left or right preference and we know that if we vote for a smaller party or god forbid, an independent who actually sees politics as something other than a gravy train, then the party that we like least might get in? The right to vote for candidates that have been parachuted in based on vote worthiness?
This country has not been governed by a mandated government for as long as i can remember. Whoevever you vote for, you will get one of the three main parties.
When there is a "none of the above" option, then i'll vote once more. Until then, i refuse to vote Green or UKIP or Indepdendent because by doing so, all i am doing is allowing one of the main parties to win.
It is my democratic right to withhold my vote. It is also my democratic right to complain.
If we want change in this country, we've got to stop walking sheepishly to the polling booths. If we want change in this country, the onus is on each and every one of us to learn what is really at stake - issues such as fractional reserve banking, the nature of inflation and deflation, the way that government finance works, the way that capital markets work. These are not, at high level, difficult concepts, and yet the government continues to buy votes through schemes such as Help 2 Buy and Funding for Lending which are placing this country on the edge of a financial precipice.
[quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.[/p][/quote]The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties. With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites). I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.[/p][/quote]Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.[/p][/quote]I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there. Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories. But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems. I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate. Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities. I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE'[/p][/quote]Sadly, you are peddling the establishment's lie. I've voted in every general election since i was 18. I've also been a Tory branch chair. I've seen it from the inside and the outside and believe me, there's nothing the establishment likes more than seeing the sheep thinking they are exercising some kind of democratic right. A democratic right to what? Vote for only one of three parties, because most of us have a left or right preference and we know that if we vote for a smaller party or god forbid, an independent who actually sees politics as something other than a gravy train, then the party that we like least might get in? The right to vote for candidates that have been parachuted in based on vote worthiness? This country has not been governed by a mandated government for as long as i can remember. Whoevever you vote for, you will get one of the three main parties. When there is a "none of the above" option, then i'll vote once more. Until then, i refuse to vote Green or UKIP or Indepdendent because by doing so, all i am doing is allowing one of the main parties to win. It is my democratic right to withhold my vote. It is also my democratic right to complain. If we want change in this country, we've got to stop walking sheepishly to the polling booths. If we want change in this country, the onus is on each and every one of us to learn what is really at stake - issues such as fractional reserve banking, the nature of inflation and deflation, the way that government finance works, the way that capital markets work. These are not, at high level, difficult concepts, and yet the government continues to buy votes through schemes such as Help 2 Buy and Funding for Lending which are placing this country on the edge of a financial precipice. JamesYoung
  • Score: 1

2:56pm Sat 7 Jun 14

NinjaNewsman says...

wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,,
a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money
wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,, a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money NinjaNewsman
  • Score: 2

6:18pm Sat 7 Jun 14

Genghis says...

Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
JamesYoung wrote:
Micke12 wrote:
Genghis wrote:
Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced.

At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not.

The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.
I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power.

61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises.

The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box.

We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate.

But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.
The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties.
With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites).
I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.
Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.
I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there.

Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories.

But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems.

I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate.

Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities.

I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE'
If a person pays taxes that fund the government of this country, it's that that gives them the right to complain about how that is used and how we're governed.

A choice between two or three political parties that promise everything but always deliver nothing, is not a choice. It's a vote for carrying on parliamentary business as usual. In other words, no change. That is why people do not vote. I voted, but for 'none of the above.' I do not want an endless continuation of the status quo and none of the candidates standing for election offered anything different to that.
[quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]JamesYoung[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Micke12[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Genghis[/bold] wrote: Micke12, I understand your points and can sympathise with you. However, having a go at those that have to deliver the service is a bit misplaced. At the last election, people voted in a government with policies that included cutting the cost of benefits paid out and reducing the number of public sector employees. Going by the comments in this paper this was very popular. This government has done exactly that, regardless of whether their cuts affect people in genuine need or not. The centralisation of services, such as post, also cuts costs and allows for more staff to be shed. Contrary to your thought that staff have more leisure time, now that they no longer do that specific part of the job locally, DWP, like all other government departments, have been reducing the size of their workforce. Yes, this impacts on the service, or perceived lack of service, that you and others receive. But political dogma doesn't care about that, they came in to make cuts and cuts they will make. It's no skin off the politicians' noses as most people will do what's been happening on here, put the blame on the staff that have to operate the new procedures.[/p][/quote]I agree wholeheartedly, but we need to remember that this is not a voted in government, but a government in-situ because the majority of the electorate could not be bothered to vote. I have a golden rule in politics and voting - if you cannot be bothered to go out and vote, then don't complain about what the government do once in power. 61% of the eligible electorate turned out to vote and no one political party was given a working majority, but, if the other 39% had voted, there might have been a different outcome, but I sort of understand why those 39% did not vote, they have no confidence in the political parties that were on offer. All the parties had a manifesto, and no one trusted those manifestos, or, more to the point, whether the politicians would actually deliver their promises. The government, however, blamed the high benefit costs directly on the unemployed and sick or disabled, when the truth is that the greatest percentage of the whole benefits bill was taken up by pensions and pension credits. Perhaps it is wrong to blame all this on the people that deliver the services, and the wrath should be placed directly at the doors of the current coalition government. I suspect, however, that next years elections might force those in power now, to reconsider their welfare benefits position. There is a distinct possibility that certain other political parties, previously considered to be fringe parties, may well make major inroads into government and onto parliamentary seats within the country as a whole, as those who have been affected by these cuts, both in social welfare benefits, and in local government and council housing benefits, by virtue of the so-called bedroom tax, will send the main three political parties a bloody nose at the ballot box. We all know that the only thing that any politician is really interested in is getting their feet into the door of either the houses of parliament or even the doors of number 10 and 11 Downing Street, and then milking the system for all it is worth. There is some value in the plans to allow voters to have their MP 'recalled' if the electorate feels that the incumbent is not serving the local electorate. it would concentrate that MPs mind on what is important, with the knowledge that they could be sacked if they fail their electorate. But, to be fair to any government, it is not always their fault, but the fault of background civil servants who wield quite substantial power in the corridors of power in Whitehall. It is time that civil servants within national government were placed in a position where they can be brought to account for their actions not just by parliament, but by the electorate through parliamentary petition to the Leaders of the House in both the Commons and Lords, just as civil servants in local government should be able to be challenge by the local population.[/p][/quote]The reason there is such apathy is that (i) half of the electorate don't have the slightest comprehension of the issues at stake and (ii) the ones that do have no faith in the major parties. With no "none of the above" box on the voting slip, it is more appropriate to conclude that a decision not to vote, as in my case, is a refusal to play the game. The idea that you must vote to have an opinion is a lie perpetuated by the three major parties, who are the beneficiaries. Three parties, one policy (impoverish the rest of us for the sake of the power elites). I consider that my opinion is therefore as valid as that of the sheep who vote for one of the three major parties and by doing so continue to legitimise a corrupt government.[/p][/quote]Hear, hear! Putting an 'X' on a piece of paper does not confer a right to an opinion on how the country is governed. Paying the taxes imposed by the government however, gives everybody that pays them, the right to question, praise or criticise those that spend those taxes on our behalf.[/p][/quote]I did not say that they were not entitled to an opinion if they fail to vote, but they should not have the right to complain if they do not vote - slight difference in context there. Yes, voters are quite apathetic when it comes to elections, and this is brought about because the people who do not vote, don't vote because they, rightly or wrongly, do not trust the 3 major incumbents in politics, i.e. Liberals, Labour and Tories. But, you can only make a difference if you DO vote, otherwise, as we have seen in this current coalition government, you are governing under a non mandated regime, which, in this case, is being held together by the LibDems. I have no idea as to how to get people back to the ballot box so that politicians and governments are voted in on a high turnout mandate. Our political system, whilst better than some countries, has fallen short of being trusted by the people, by virtue of a majority of those same politicians, jumping on the gravy train with bonuses and allowances and expenses claims irregularities. I think the main thrust in this argument is, 'YES', everyone has the right to an opinion, but if you fail to cast your vote, you can not turn that opinion into down right complaints as you have failed to exercise your most important right in our country, the right to 'VOTE'[/p][/quote]If a person pays taxes that fund the government of this country, it's that that gives them the right to complain about how that is used and how we're governed. A choice between two or three political parties that promise everything but always deliver nothing, is not a choice. It's a vote for carrying on parliamentary business as usual. In other words, no change. That is why people do not vote. I voted, but for 'none of the above.' I do not want an endless continuation of the status quo and none of the candidates standing for election offered anything different to that. Genghis
  • Score: 1

7:13pm Sat 7 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

NinjaNewsman wrote:
wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,,
a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money
So you don't approve of free school meals, bus passes, pensions, roads, railways, NHS, education? I could go on. They are all free at the point of delivery. You actually want a system whereby the people with the money buy whatever they can afford and the people without money go without? I don't think so.
[quote][p][bold]NinjaNewsman[/bold] wrote: wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,, a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money[/p][/quote]So you don't approve of free school meals, bus passes, pensions, roads, railways, NHS, education? I could go on. They are all free at the point of delivery. You actually want a system whereby the people with the money buy whatever they can afford and the people without money go without? I don't think so. breamoreboy
  • Score: -2

10:55pm Sat 7 Jun 14

lauraintheclouds says...

NinjaNewsman wrote:
wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,,
a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money
If you really think it takes 10 mins to fill out those forms you truly are showing your stupidity!
[quote][p][bold]NinjaNewsman[/bold] wrote: wait a second , firstly why have a baby when you clearly cant afford it , 2nd why have a baby when you have no funds in the bank ,,,,, a hood and rain cover for his wheelchair, proper flooring for his bedroom and maybe even a well-deserved holiday for his family. ,,, are you actually joking you want to say that they should get money of the tax payer for a FAMILY HOLIDAY are you actually kiddding , 4th should put the forms in on time , 4 to 6 weeks to return a form that gets you this money !!!! dont even go there saying oh but im looking after someone , takes 10 mins to fill a form in you saying you never went past a post box or the job centre in 4-6 weeks !!!!! should look after him better then and post his mail instead of leaving it for a month and and half , yeah he is disabled Dosnt mean you should be entiled to free money[/p][/quote]If you really think it takes 10 mins to fill out those forms you truly are showing your stupidity! lauraintheclouds
  • Score: 5

12:46pm Mon 9 Jun 14

cj07589 says...

iansedwell wrote:
This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.
Being no different to the last lot of thieving liebour self serving conceited, heartless millionaire public schoolboys who deliberately buy/import votes by promising jam tomorrow. Hardly a sustainable argument, can't you see through the smoke and mirrors??
Besides the real crime here is the £ billions given away each year to despots and dictators around the world who spend it on fast cars and properties yet the sheep still vote for the same old broken record promises.
[quote][p][bold]iansedwell[/bold] wrote: This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.[/p][/quote]Being no different to the last lot of thieving liebour self serving conceited, heartless millionaire public schoolboys who deliberately buy/import votes by promising jam tomorrow. Hardly a sustainable argument, can't you see through the smoke and mirrors?? Besides the real crime here is the £ billions given away each year to despots and dictators around the world who spend it on fast cars and properties yet the sheep still vote for the same old broken record promises. cj07589
  • Score: -1

5:37pm Mon 9 Jun 14

Taxpayer!! says...

Still the point is being missed, I feel totally grieved that some poor old guy that has been saving his money in a jar for probably months has given to this family who are already paid ££ in DLA money not just for the child that totally needs it but even his mother claims it for her disabilities but was go karting and the weekend and is now planning a trip to Thorpe Park!! Disability living allowance my arse!!
Still the point is being missed, I feel totally grieved that some poor old guy that has been saving his money in a jar for probably months has given to this family who are already paid ££ in DLA money not just for the child that totally needs it but even his mother claims it for her disabilities but was go karting and the weekend and is now planning a trip to Thorpe Park!! Disability living allowance my arse!! Taxpayer!!
  • Score: 2

6:56pm Mon 9 Jun 14

breamoreboy says...

cj07589 wrote:
iansedwell wrote:
This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.
Being no different to the last lot of thieving liebour self serving conceited, heartless millionaire public schoolboys who deliberately buy/import votes by promising jam tomorrow. Hardly a sustainable argument, can't you see through the smoke and mirrors??
Besides the real crime here is the £ billions given away each year to despots and dictators around the world who spend it on fast cars and properties yet the sheep still vote for the same old broken record promises.
So instead you want us to vote for a party that's been supported by so vile an organisation as Britain First. This was founded by people from the extreme right of the BNP, now that's saying something.
[quote][p][bold]cj07589[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]iansedwell[/bold] wrote: This speaks volumes as to the twisted, perverted minds that populate this evil, wicked, disgusting government of self-serving, conceited, heartless, millionaire public schoolboys.[/p][/quote]Being no different to the last lot of thieving liebour self serving conceited, heartless millionaire public schoolboys who deliberately buy/import votes by promising jam tomorrow. Hardly a sustainable argument, can't you see through the smoke and mirrors?? Besides the real crime here is the £ billions given away each year to despots and dictators around the world who spend it on fast cars and properties yet the sheep still vote for the same old broken record promises.[/p][/quote]So instead you want us to vote for a party that's been supported by so vile an organisation as Britain First. This was founded by people from the extreme right of the BNP, now that's saying something. breamoreboy
  • Score: 0

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