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Developer reviewing the Pavilion situation (From Dorset Echo)
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Developer reviewing the Pavilion situation
7:37am Tuesday 2nd December 2008
DEVELOPER Howard Holdings admitted today that it is reviewing the £120 million redevelopment scheme for Weymouth Pavilion.
Its statement throws fresh doubt into the whole future of the controversial project.
“The proposal is under review. We are like every other developer in the UK and every other scheme in the UK.”
Geoff Sparrow, Howard Holdings
Howard’s investment director Geoff Sparrow told the Echo: “The proposal is under review. We are like every other developer in the UK and every other scheme in the UK.”
Mr Sparrow said Howard Holdings had nothing more to add to its statement.
But Weymouth and Portland Borough Council chief executive Tom Grainger said: “Their comment is consistent with what we understood their position to be, namely that the economics of the scheme need to be reviewed.
“However, we still need prompt confirmation that Howard Holdings intends to proceed with its planning application for the scheme.”
The authority has been desperately trying to get confirmation from the company over whether it intends to meet its building obligations under the building agreement and whether it will be going ahead with a planning application.
Mr Grainger said: “We have followed the legal process set out in the development agreement and we now await a response from Howard Holdings by the deadline set, which is early next week.
“If the deadline passes without a response from them then we will take legal advice on what our next step should be.”
At stake is a controversial scheme which includes 340 apartments in a complex rising in parts to eight storeys and a remodelled Pavilion Theatre with the backstage and front-of-house facilities revamped.
The project also includes a marina with 290 berths, a world heritage centre, an improved ferry terminal, a covered car park with 400 spaces, beachside performance space and a 140-bed four-star hotel, shops, restaurants, strengthened sea defences and a pier.
Uncertainty over the future of the scheme has rekindled opposition to it by objectors who want to see the whole redevelopment scaled down.
They claim that the credit crunch means that it will be virtually impossible for any large-scale scheme to be achieved on time and they have renewed calls for a public inquiry to be held into the scheme.
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Your Say YourEcho
Techie, Weymouth says...
9:39am Tue 2 Dec 08
mikeman, Portland says...
9:59am Tue 2 Dec 08
Albo, Wyke Regis says...
10:12am Tue 2 Dec 08
/sarcasm
ian paul, Preston says...
10:38am Tue 2 Dec 08
I dont normally write regarding planning issues, I do trust the planners on the Borough council to do a reasonible job on behalf of all of us rate payers.
Please wonder around Weymouth take off your rose couloured spectacles and just take in what you see. A very old sea side resort which is run down and stuggling its not good for the current restaurants, traders, hoteliers and holiday makers.
Howard Holdings are a company whom believe they have the investment, the fore sight and the ability to give us a new developed habour scheme.
I hope this is still a good opportunity for them if they need a extra floor to make it viable allow it we should encourage investment into Weymouth not build walls to prevent it.
The Pavillion Theatre, what is good about it in its existing state.
The Existing Harbour is small expensive and full, with very little to encourage boaters to come and stay in Weymouth.
Most of the larger UK companies hold conferences around the UK, would they come to Weymouth! NO good hotels are required, along with cheaper smaller conference hotels (hey we have these).
We are missing out on this opportunity completly, We need people to come to Weymouth, impress them then they return again and again. We need better access roads, we need smarter venues.
Please dont stand still Weymouth, go forward or be left behind for ever! New Development now means a successful future jobs and opportunities! get on with it quickly please Howard Holdings.
Ian-Bowleaze Coveway
stephen b., Weymouth says...
12:42pm Tue 2 Dec 08
mikeman, Portland says...
1:59pm Tue 2 Dec 08
ian paul wrote:Hi Ian I think its you that needs to look, at what you have written its nothing but crap we have all the marina’s we want & most people object to the size of the development as it is, without adding anymore & we also have conference facilities & hotels on Portland as well as some in Weymouth.
Hi Every one, I dont normally write regarding planning issues, I do trust the planners on the Borough council to do a reasonible job on behalf of all of us rate payers. Please wonder around Weymouth take off your rose couloured spectacles and just take in what you see. A very old sea side resort which is run down and stuggling its not good for the current restaurants, traders, hoteliers and holiday makers. Howard Holdings are a company whom believe they have the investment, the fore sight and the ability to give us a new developed habour scheme. I hope this is still a good opportunity for them if they need a extra floor to make it viable allow it we should encourage investment into Weymouth not build walls to prevent it. The Pavillion Theatre, what is good about it in its existing state. The Existing Harbour is small expensive and full, with very little to encourage boaters to come and stay in Weymouth. Most of the larger UK companies hold conferences around the UK, would they come to Weymouth! NO good hotels are required, along with cheaper smaller conference hotels (hey we have these). We are missing out on this opportunity completly, We need people to come to Weymouth, impress them then they return again and again. We need better access roads, we need smarter venues. Please dont stand still Weymouth, go forward or be left behind for ever! New Development now means a successful future jobs and opportunities! get on with it quickly please Howard Holdings. Ian-Bowleaze Coveway
You are only looking at it as a means to make money from tourists well it may supprise you to know that a lot of people live here & may take the same attitude as I in so much as this is my town first & foremost if tourists want to come here that’s fine but we don’t have to build the town just for them. No I do not want the HH development it is to big & will be a blot on the landscape & the marina is just a ploy to sell the overpriced flats with a berth. If this was built & it upset the tidal flow where would your tourists be without a beach to sit on.
ian paul, Preston says...
3:58pm Tue 2 Dec 08
What does the future for Weymouth hold if we don't invest in new developments. We have an ageing population,an old fashioned town,a very low paid workforce, What is the answer. Its very easy for any one to say what you don't want.Look
how many shops are empty, how many restaurants, bars and hotels change hands quickly. Investment is the future we have the olympics coming lets work on making Weymouth a place to be proud off.
Skiff, Weymouth says...
4:22pm Tue 2 Dec 08
By objecting and delaying and trying to force what they consider to be a better solution (ie. Just fix the Pavillion and leave the rest of the eyesore) the protesters, if successful, will have achieved not only the retention of a dismal and depressing eyesore, but a stack of extra costs for the residents of Weymouth, because without a developer we would all have to pay.
I agree with Techie, and hope that HH’s review shows the project is still viable.
I look forward with interest to the FESoW’s (Flat Earth Society of Weymouth) next project. Probably something to do with banning the Olympics on the grounds our sailors might fall off the edge…
mark@greenhill, weymouth says...
5:05pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Unfortunatly the "keep weymouth in the dark ages brigade" still think that someone else will come along and invest in this very tired looking town.
They seem quite happy to object to anything that encourages more people & more money in.
In this day and financial climate, we need to grab all and any opportunity to get investment in, especially as the harbour is going to cost us millions to rebuild without some sort of developer taking it over.
The hard fact is, that developers need to make a profit and why shouldnt they?
If this project needs another floor of flats or a larger marina or even, dare I say it, a smaller theater, then so be it.
I know a lot of people will wail about the view, but how many have actually looked at what is there right now?
And don't the anti everything brigade realise, there was probably just as much opposition to the very thing they are trying to save?
After all, neither the pavilion or the nothe fort are natural landscape are they?
Skiff, Weymouth says...
5:32pm Tue 2 Dec 08
franchise, weymouth says...
6:03pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Instead of all our letters of the yesses and nos, why not ideas. It has been mentioned that Weymouth has an ageing population. This will not always be the case, why not a youth centre to get kids off the street and doing something purposeful. The noise, if loud,
would not be heard by anyone out there. It could have all kind of venues for training, health, etc., for the whole population. A few separate purposeful buildings to get the population together and not apart, which is what the present plans are. This is just off the cuff, I am sure there are great ideas floating out there which would be more suitable.
maggot, Weymouth says...
6:09pm Tue 2 Dec 08
If you hate Weymouth as much you seem to why are you living here?
maggot, Weymouth says...
6:13pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Sammy Treadlight, Weymouth says...
6:24pm Tue 2 Dec 08
dar, bristol says...
6:29pm Tue 2 Dec 08
dorsetbeachcomber, Preston says...
6:55pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Sally1, Weymouth says...
8:28pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Big isn't always better either, go to Lyme Regis for the day and see a thriving, redeveloped, affluent, seaside resort, full of independent shops, creative planning and tourists all year round.
So long as Weymouth relies on tourism, the wages will always be low. Cleaners, chambermaids, waitresses are never going to be paid more because HH build some luxury flats. Sustainable development will be the only way to take people out of relative poverty. All we will do is adhere to the usual rich profiting from the poor scenario that the UK has accepted as the norm.
Skiff, Weymouth says...
8:54pm Tue 2 Dec 08
That apart, I’m not entirely clear what you mean – in this context - when you say ‘sustainable development’ is the way to take people out of relative poverty. Weymouth is a seaside resort and has relied on tourism (to whatever extent) ever since George 3rd’s time. What did you have in mind, given our history and heritage?
Btw, I think you’ll find ‘relative poverty’ is present all over the world: by definition it’s not confined to the UK.
Skiff, Weymouth says...
9:05pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Couldn't have put it better.
ian paul, Preston says...
10:39pm Tue 2 Dec 08
Maggot,
I fully take on board about how Weymouth is full in summer! We have fantastic beaches which are really well kept. The entertainment through out the summer months is fantastic I love the beach volley ball, kites, cycle displays but we need to keep Weymouth a all year round resort for local business to thrive. The clubs and pubs work hard promoting entertainment for all ages. We have a great reputation for Hen and stag nights. Unfortuntely we are not going to be able to sustain these good british holiday times, which we have enjoyed over the past 40 years, if we don't change.
Here we have a investment company wanting to make our town a leading resort again.
Please understand that more investment will then generate more income for all.
I'm not daft to realize that a lot of the employment will be low paid work, but a lot of good jobs will also come to. The additional marina wiil require more engineers, boat sales, estate agents (sorry to mention them). The constuction industry around here is on its knees this would surely have spin offs to help them.
What I am trying to say is you would never turn a new Jaguar or Aston Martin away for free, Thats what I feel Weymouth is doing bye not welcoming investment in the new harbour scheme.
The council would then be able to spend the extra income from the new council taxes from the new apartments on the old town.
Don't stand still Weymouth it just to old fashioned and negative.
Sally1, Weymouth says...
11:24pm Tue 2 Dec 08
By investing so heavily in the tourist industry, Weymouth is dependent upon the ability of people to afford holidays, and expensive ones at that when compared to cheap deals abroad. If the council invested in making Weymouth and Portland a great place to live and not just to visit, by rich or poor, we might find people wanting to spend money here all year round.
I wonder what the statistics are for people moving in and out of the area? I have no idea. But it's a thought isn't it?
What happens if we become completely dependent upon second home owners coming here for 2 or 3 weeks of the year to sail their boats during the nice weather, but not spending much cash over the whole year?
I spent most of my teenage and early adult years working in the hotels as a chambermaid etc. Then I left and went to college, now I am back there are no jobs really to speak of. Back to the chamber-maiding then? So my income is so low I can hardly contribute towards the local economy effectively.
This isn't just an argument about development or no development, it's an argument about what sort of development we need. Yes, the building industry will have work for a while and then what?
I understand that a lot of people on this forum believe that HH are our only hope, a bit like the new road issue. But have any alternatives been really explored with regard to the pavilion area? Imaginative ones?
To me it appears that the council lack the imagination and more importantly the drive to really get out there and see what the alternatives could be. I don't know what they are either, but I'm not in local government. I (rightly or wrongly) depend upon my representatives and officers to do this work for me. And I'm afraid our council seem to be one of the most boring, middle of the road, easy life, get rich quick councils around - living in the 20th century not the 21st.
biggestoaf, Weymouth says...
7:23am Wed 3 Dec 08
mikeman, Portland says...
8:44am Wed 3 Dec 08
dorsetbeachcomber, Preston says...
9:56am Wed 3 Dec 08
Atalanta, Weymouth says...
10:04am Wed 3 Dec 08
We can't rely on good weather, so plenty of indoor choices for all age ranges would provide something to do at any time of the year. Those employed at such venues then spend money at others, the whole local economy would benefit with necessary items to run such a business being locally sourced. Outside these entertainment venues could be gardens and/or summer activities. Well kept gardens and floral stuff, something which I think Weymouth excels at, would give more visual appeal if around the town area, e.g. Westwey Road, the bridge embankment. Yes, get rid of government stuff from the prime sites and make the sites appealing, as after all they are the areas that visitors see. Concrete alone doesn't do it, no matter how nice a new building might look initially, it doesn't last.
The pier, should be something of an attraction in itself, as it used to be. That's not to say that there's no room for commercial enterprise, the whole could be blended quite well, but the balance needs to be right and blend with our lovely Georgian seafront and picturesque harbour.
Skiff, Weymouth says...
10:18am Wed 3 Dec 08
mikeman, Portland says...
11:20am Wed 3 Dec 08
Genghis, Portland says...
12:21pm Wed 3 Dec 08
Ask Archie wrote:Why didn't you warn us of the Credit Crunch and recession at the same time? Indeed why didn't you warn the Stock Markets then there wouldn't have been a recession.
Nobody should be really surprised by this,HH have been tagging the council along right from the start. I said in comments months & months ago that HH would not produce the goods.
franchise, weymouth says...
2:07pm Wed 3 Dec 08
Ask Archie, Weymouth says...
2:16pm Wed 3 Dec 08
Genghis wrote:Sorry I would have if I could have.My point is HH were due to put in planning BEFORE any crunch hit.They have delayed time and time again.Even when they were granted the extra stories on the plans they still did not submit plans.I'm sorry but I think we should ask why?
Ask Archie wrote: Nobody should be really surprised by this,HH have been tagging the council along right from the start. I said in comments months & months ago that HH would not produce the goods.Why didn't you warn us of the Credit Crunch and recession at the same time? Indeed why didn't you warn the Stock Markets then there wouldn't have been a recession.
HilaryS, Rodwell says...
5:03pm Wed 3 Dec 08
ANGIE:-D, weymouth says...
6:27pm Wed 3 Dec 08
i do like weymouth the way it is but could do with a facelift,not new flats
Sally1, Weymouth says...
7:33pm Wed 3 Dec 08
In Germany there is a company called Space Walk (I know that sounds a bit hippy, but hippy they are not) They are made up of architects, town planners and artists and they are brought in for anything up to two years to work with a community in finding creative solutions to urban regeneration schemes. They work across all sections of the community, looking at needs and wants, realistic and idealistic and over time they draw together ideas, try some of them out and then contribute their outcomes and findings towards the development. Some of the outcomes are radical, some are not at all, but they at least represent a sense of community ownership and pride. This in turn is reflected in the final decision process. Not all the outcomes cost huges somes of money, but they do have an effect on the development. A good example I can think of is a an area that was going to be designated for parking (part of a much bigger regeneration scheme) instead became a community garden. Simple, but effective use of space in an urban environment, used by all generations.
What interests me, is the collaboration of town-planners, architects and artists, so those who feel that the artists might be unrealistic have their concerns balanced by the rational work of the town planners; those who feel the town planners are not considering aesthetics have this balanced by the work of the artists.
And of equal importance is the time that is given to the process, enabling real dialogue to take place and giving time to finding realisitic solututions.
Rome wasn't built in day.
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Ask Archie, Weymouth says...
8:18am Tue 2 Dec 08
I said in comments months & months ago that HH would not produce the goods.